#898 Ignorance and fear sending us backwards (Vaccinations)

I can’t even believe that this is a thing. The anti-science sentiments march on in this country and they’re putting us all at risk of a resurgence of eradicated diseases

Show Notes

Ch. 1: Opening Theme: A Fond Farewell - From a Basement On the Hill

Ch. 2: Act 1: Vaccines Don't Cause Autism: Healthcare Triage #12 - @HCTriage - Air Date: 01-19-14

Ch. 3: Song 1: Fraud - Once a Jolly Swagman, Always a Jolly Swagman

Ch. 4: Act 2: On the Anti-Vax Non-troversy - @onthemedia - Air Date: 2-6-15

Ch. 5: Song 2: Chorus of Fools - Chorus of Fools - Single

Ch. 6: Act 3: Anti-vaxxer Californians start a new measles outbreak at Disneyland - @TWiBnation - Air Date: 2-3-15

Ch. 7: Song 3: Rebuild - We Are Rising

Ch. 8: Act 4: Myth: Vaccine Deniers Are All Hippie Liberals - @davidpakmanshow - Air Date: 02-01-15

Ch. 9: Song 4: "Fear is a villain" by Theo Bard

Ch. 10: Act 5: The Dangerous Arrogance of the Anti-Vaxxers - @majorityfm - Air Date: 02-04-15

Ch. 11: Song 5: F**k You - True North

Ch. 12: Act 6: Vaccines: How to Avoid Killing and Maiming Children - @MarkFiore's Animation - Air Date: 02-10-15

Ch. 13: Song 6: "Mitch Benn's song to Anti-Vaxer parents - The Now Show - Air Date: 2-6-15"

Ch. 14: Act 7: GOP vaccination fuss suggests politics at play - Rachel @Maddow Show - Air Date: 2-5-15

Ch. 15: Song 7: Dumb Ways to Die - Dumb Ways to Die - Single

Ch. 16: Act 8: Fighting the Anti-Vaxxer Movement with @Voices4Vaccines - Best of the Left Activism

Ch. 17: Song 8: Right to Complain - Backatown (Bonus Track Version)

Ch. 18: Act 9: Vaccines are for the Public Good - @Thom_Hartmann - Air Date: 02-03-15


Ch. 20: If it's within your means then you should change - Nick from Cincinnati

Ch. 21: Advice on making vegitarianism easy - Dave from Olympia, WA

Voicemail Music: Loud Pipes - Classics

Ch. 22: Final comments on food choice and vaccination voicemails

Closing Music: Here We Are - Everyone's in Everyone

Activism: Fighting the Anti-Vaxxer Movement with @Voices4Vaccines

Take Action:

Use the resources at: Voices For Vaccines

Follow Voices For Vaccines on Twitter and Facebook.

Find out more about the adult pertussis vaccination at: AdultVaccination.org

Sources/further reading:

"A Polio Survivor’s Plea: Vaccinate Your Children” by Minda Dentler at Time.com

"Anti-Vaxxers Brought Measles to the Happiest Place on Earth: A measles outbreak has sickened 70 people at Disneyland, and could be the spark that brings the once-eradicated disease back in force.” by Russell Saunders at The Daily Beast

"Your feelings about vaccines don't trump another child's medical reality” by Jessica Valenti at The Guardian

"Elizabeth Warren Asks Questions About Vaccines, Gets Shocking Answers” by Kaili Joy Gray at Wonkette

"Dear anti-vaxxers: Stop using autism as a bogeyman” by Maria Mora at SheKnows

"I Didn’t Vaccinate My Child—And I Regret It: How I finally discovered that vaccinating your kids is the right thing to do.” by Sally Kohn

Written by BOTL social media/activism director Katie Klabusich

Produced by Jay! Tomlinson

Thanks for listening!

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Showing 27 reactions

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  • commented 2015-03-23 22:14:47 -0400
    I am really shocked at the bias of this show. There are a lot of reasons why people choose not to vaccinate their children. I suggest you watch this film that might help explain some of the reasons. It shows how much Big Pharma lies about how safe those vaccines really are and how profitable it is.
  • commented 2015-02-19 00:18:44 -0500
    Why does regression among the vast majority of autistic children seem to coincide with the vaccination schedule? If science spent more money and effort on that very question we wouldn’t even be having this conversation. Pushing for answers into the roots of autism is truly what will put this to bed. If all the MD’s and PHD’s could come up with a solid explanation for the cause/causes of Autism this would be done.
  • commented 2015-02-19 00:08:36 -0500
    Jun 28, 2008 – By Katie Wright Julie Gerderding’s recent admission that much of the CDC’s research exonerating vaccines as a trigger for autism was both …
  • commented 2015-02-19 00:02:24 -0500
    No, you didn’t ask the medic to be quarantined…… But, your scenario is unrealistic. I, being a former medical professional married to a medical professional tire of scenarios that equivocate to “skylarking in frivolity” put forth by laymen trying to prove a point. Common sense and cool heads are needed. But, what is needed MORE is research into Autism, Mitochondrial disorder, and any possible links between the two. Have you read up on the POSSIBLE links of vaccines and Mitochondrial disorder? CDC says more research is needed. Are you telling me that you would get vaccinated for any and all diseases if possible? Ebola? Even if your chance of exposure is slim to nil? MMR/Polio, I get it. Terrible epidemics at one time. When was the last Hep B epidemic? It’s not an occupational hazard for an infant.
  • commented 2015-02-18 23:53:26 -0500
    //BTW, Ron Paul is a doctor……… Don’t blindly worship letters after a name, research the individual. There are educated idiots too.//

    Thanks for the advice. That is not a reason to trust a person not qualified (however valuable a service a paramedic provides he/she is not a doctor) to comment of efficacy of vaccines. Instead trust the CDC officials. To keep you safe is their job and that is what they are trained to do.
  • commented 2015-02-18 23:45:22 -0500
    I did not ask the medic to be quarantined in my scenario, did I?

    You on the other hand would say no to an Ebola vaccine if one were available.

    And why are we supposed take advice from a medic anyway and not from a MD or a CDC official?

    PS: I would not ask the brave nurse to be quarantined simply because she could not pass the Ebola virus on to others. In order to pass the Ebola virus on to others you have be violently sick in the first place. That is why a quarantine was not needed.
  • commented 2015-02-18 23:32:42 -0500
    BTW, Ron Paul is a doctor……… Don’t blindly worship letters after a name, research the individual. There are educated idiots too.
  • commented 2015-02-18 23:28:58 -0500
    What medic would ever leave the fire house in tour gear? ( uniform ) or go home without showering?!?! I have a scenario for you….. Quit watching Chicago fire and ER. And I know a MD’s I wouldn’t let treat my dog. I’m done arguing this. A medical professional practices universal precautions. Like I said, your line of reasoning is the same that tried to quarantine a brave, selfless Ebola nurse, because after all, what if….
  • commented 2015-02-18 23:19:55 -0500
    //HOW is a child getting exposed to Hep B in the first place?!?!?!?//

    I just ran through a scenario for you. Here, let me do it again. You (as a paramedic) bring home (on the odd day when you did not clean yourself well) other’s bodily fluids (Which happened to have the virus. You ask how? Simple, the person you treated just came back from a overseas trip to Asia) on your cloths, skin, or what ever and pass it on to infants (if not your baby may be the baby of your sister who was visiting you) in your house if you had any. Innumerable number of such scenarios can be made up.

    //But, what does a F’n paramedic married to a F’n histologist know?//

    And what would all those doctors and virologists with all their MD and PhD degrees know?
  • commented 2015-02-18 23:18:20 -0500
    From the article you wanted me to read : Transmission
    Spread through contact with the blood of an infected person or by having sex with an infected person
    Again, how is an infant risking exposure?!?! Maybe as soon as his circumcision healed I should have told him to wear a condom…..
  • commented 2015-02-18 23:11:38 -0500
    WAS …..WAS…. A medic……. Two words: universal precautions
    By your logic " contaminated without knowing it " you would be the person who forcibly quarantines Ebola nurses!!!!!!!
  • commented 2015-02-18 23:08:16 -0500
    Jesus Christ!!!!! HOW is a child getting exposed to Hep B in the first place?!?!?!? Why not Anthrax vaccine too? F’n really? No, I didn’t agree, and still don’t agree with a mandatory Hep vaccine. But, what does a F’n paramedic married to a F’n histologist know?
  • commented 2015-02-18 23:01:49 -0500

    //I was a paramedic.//

    You (as a paramedic) bring home (on the odd day when you did not clean yourself well) other’s bodily fluids on your cloths, skin, or what ever and pass it on to infants in your house if you had any. If infants are infected then it could be fatal. Why not just prevent it with a vaccine?

    Also read about the disease here at this WHO site.


    The hepatitis B virus can survive outside the body for at least 7 days. During this time, the virus can still cause infection if it enters the body of a person who is not protected by the vaccine.

    You still do not want kids to be vaccinated?
  • commented 2015-02-18 22:48:37 -0500
    Colin Sikon,

    //I am FOR vaccinations, but why are we vaccinating infants for hepatitis and other unlikely risks? I can’t understand this.//

    In case you really want to know why vaccinated infants for hepatitis then is some info from Mayo clinic. Please read the second sentence in the second paragraph.

    **Hepatitis B is a serious liver infection caused by the hepatitis B virus (HBV). For some people, hepatitis B infection becomes chronic, meaning it lasts more than six months. Having chronic hepatitis B increases your risk of developing liver failure, liver cancer or cirrhosis — a condition that causes permanent scarring of the liver.

    Most people infected with hepatitis B as adults recover fully, even if their signs and symptoms are severe. Infants and children are more likely to develop a chronic hepatitis B infection. A vaccine can prevent hepatitis B, but there’s no cure if you have it. If you’re infected, taking certain precautions can help prevent spreading HBV to others.**

    From the link below.

  • commented 2015-02-18 22:48:30 -0500
    I was a paramedic. I got my hepatitis vaccine as an adult because of my career choice involving direct contact with stranger’s bodily fluids.My generation was not vaccinated as infants for hepatitis. How is a child, or infant going to come in contact with hepatitis? MMR/Measles fine… Totally on board with those.
  • commented 2015-02-18 22:38:37 -0500
    //I am FOR vaccinations, but why are we vaccinating infants for hepatitis and other unlikely risks? I can’t understand this.//

    What other unlikely risk? Can you please elaborate?
  • commented 2015-02-18 22:33:16 -0500
    //I am FOR vaccinations, but why are we vaccinating infants for hepatitis and other unlikely risks? I can’t understand this.//

    The following from CDC about Hepatitis B (http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vpd-vac/hepb/ ) should convince anyone who is FOR vaccination to take the Hepatitis B vaccination.

    A disease of the liver caused by hepatitis B virus
    Potentially none when first infected (likelihood of early symptoms decreases with the person’s age)
    If present: yellow skin or eyes, tiredness, stomach ache, loss of appetite, nausea, or joint pain
    The younger the person, the greater the likelihood of staying infected and having life-long liver problems, such as scarring of the liver and liver cancer
    Spread through contact with the blood of an infected person or by having sex with an infected person
    Hepatitis B vaccine is will prevent this disease.
  • commented 2015-02-18 22:00:39 -0500
    As a father of a son with autism, and a self proclaimed progressive I’d like to warn the left about the tone we use when discussing autism. I found some of the clips a little off-putting. I’m sure I’m a little sensitive probably but speaking in absolutist tones about a disease/condition/disorder that we know little about is the same thing we lambast the right for doing on so many things. We are NOT making allies or winning anyone over when we make broad characterizations about a disorder with vast degrees of a spectrum. Like saying “it’s completely manageable”-(TWIB Radio).

    Those of us who live daily dealing with autistic children are quite angry that the real conversation is NOT being heard. I am FOR vaccinations, but why are we vaccinating infants for hepatitis and other unlikely risks? I can’t understand this.
  • commented 2015-02-17 21:44:58 -0500

    But corporations are making money off of polio and small pox vaccines. Besides how do you know the it was these vaccines and not hippie prayers that eradicated these diseases. Clearly research showing the health hazards of polio and small pox vaccines do not see the light of day because the scientific establishment does not allow the publication of any studies that challenges their authority. You might ask me how I know that scientific establishment suppresses these work? I just ask you to open up a medical journal and search for such article and you will not find any. Clearly shows that such articles are suppressed.

  • commented 2015-02-17 21:18:11 -0500
    I’m stunned by some of the comments here. Surprised there’s nobody complaining about the chemtrails.
    To all of you anti-vaxxers – let’s bring back polio and smallpox and see how you feel about that. Two diseases eradicated by vaccines. But, nope. Keep spewing your fact-free, tin-foil hat conspiracies. Because, yeah that makes sense.
  • commented 2015-02-17 18:53:40 -0500
    I have tried to do as many of the speakers on this week’s show advised and dig into the research on vaccines. I have spent the last decade conducting health services research and although my research area is not vaccines, I do believe I am fairly well qualified to do a literature review. To the extent that I have a bias on this issue it is probably pro-vaccine (I would like to think that the CDC would not put their full force of authority behind something that is not well grounded in evidence.) However, I am just not seeing the clear evidence. Perhaps I would if I invested more time in it than I have, but I really do not have months to devote to this.

    If the evidence is really so clear why is it so hard to find a research-grounded accounting of the risks and benefits of vaccination for each disease? I do believe that vaccines were responsible for increasing the rate of decline of many diseases, but it is also clear that most of these diseases were declining before the introduction of vaccines, and it is not at all clear to me what the incidence of these diseases would be today in the absence of vaccines. It is also clear that vaccines do cause some serious harm. (No, I do not think there is any evidence of a link with autism, but even the national Institute of Medicine has indicated that there are some children do experience serious side effects. ) Unfortunately, there have not been good long term studies to quantify the amount of harm, and much of the research that has been done on harms is methodologically pretty weak.

    When I saw this show was on vaccines I was hoping that it was going to goes through the list of concerns with vaccines and lay out the associated evidence. Unfortunately I don’t think there are enough people in the media actually talking about the evidence (other than the autism studies) create such a show. (Of course there are many people on both sides of the argument who are likely to be unswayed by evidence anyway.)
  • commented 2015-02-16 15:48:51 -0500
    Umm, really? There aren’t any government or independent agencies that do that? Thanks for the update.
  • commented 2015-02-16 13:19:56 -0500
    Do you know all research on automobile safety is done by big auto companies?
  • commented 2015-02-16 06:57:44 -0500
    I can understand the mainstream media’s position to distance themselves from skepticism of the safety of vaccinations; there are tons of advertising $$ at stake. What I don’t get is your lock-step agreement with them. I’ve heard plenty of clips in past BOTL shows criticizing our culture’s love affair with big pharma, and the questionable safety of their products. Why are vaccines so different? Why are people who question their safety lumped in with the climate deniers and tin foil hat crowd? Why do you so vehemently support vaccinations when all the claims of their effectiveness and safety come from the companies who profit from them? Why is valid research that finds different results not allowed to see the light of day or ignored? You might as well buy into the safety of fracking and deep sea drilling too, because the companies that profit from that say it’s perfectly safe.
  • commented 2015-02-16 01:38:20 -0500
    Sadly you have not done your research and probably( hopefully for you) just repeating the mainstream media on this one. Are you even aware that almost all the studies on vaccine related illness are done / funded by big Pharma? Are you aware the data/ algorithms that they base their conclusions they refuse to share with the public or independent researchers? Are you aware that some of the studies have been shown to have underreported the incidence of illness / autism following vaccines? Do you know mercury is still used in most of the influenza vaccines? Are you aware of all the studies showing the incidence of contraction of the " childhood killer diseases " we are vaccinating against are close to the same in vaccinated and unvaccinated populations? Are you aware that in a province in China with a 99+% immunization there was a recent outbreak in measles? Are you aware that most of the childhood " killer diseases"( including smallpox) were on the decline before vaccines were on the scene due to improved public health? Are you aware most of the pro vaccines studies are just looking for antibodies , one small part of a immune response to a disease? I was a Dr. for 31 years and know big Pharma is the most powerful lobby in Washington. HHS is a big revolving door with big Pharma. I believe in science , but not junk science that does not allow public access to the data of there studies. You have much more to worry about with pollution from power plants,chemical plants, overuse of antibotics, junk food, lack of chemical free water and clean food, than you do from a neighbor that does not vaccinate by 100s fold. Even Sci Fri on NPR ( a very conservative big business NPR show) had to back peddle on there show declaring everyone who questions the current vaccination schedule as unscientific and putting the population at risk, as the evidence had shown a much larger amount of fraud in the pro vaccines studies than was ever expected. Recently two researchers from Merck whistleblew Merck for faking data in the studies. Your one sided portrayal is anything but sound science. Thankfully there are docs. out there that are willing to take a stand against almost overwhelming odds and ignorance and massive propaganda campaigns by big Pharma on vaccines as the patterns of so many drugs go off pattern and become less profitable generics. Are you aware the manufacturing of these vaccine have almost complete legal immunity from averse affects of the vaccines? That the Gov is currently paying ( out of our pockets) for payment to victims of autism and other related illness from the vaccines because it is irrefutable vaccines were the cause of said illness, despite the high bars needed to show vaccines were the cause?? That these funds are constantly bankrupt or close to bankrupt due to the number of claims? Jay I can back up all the above with sound facts. You, friend , are doing what the press was doing when the Bush administration was claiming WMD and mushrooms clouds. I generally support and agree on most of the content of your shows , but this show is full of misinformation and ingorance . Sincerely, Sadly, Dr. Eatman
  • commented 2015-02-15 14:32:06 -0500
    I’m sure this will piss off a few people, but I hope anyone who reads it will keep an open mind. Here goes… While I think of myself as a tree-hugging, vegetarian (near vegan) progressive, and I love to listen to and agree with almost everything I hear on BOTL, I’m disappointed with this week’s program bashing vaccination skeptics, while ignoring opposing views from responsible alternative medicine/health proponents. I thought one of this program’s mainstays was to encourage healthy debate and fact-researching, and not blindly follow everything we hear from the mainstream media. Dr. Wakefield’s study is not the only one ever conducted, and autism is not the only problem associated with vaccinations. There was no discussion of the role of a healthy immune system in fighting disease, or other factors that help mitigate the prevalence of the germs that cause diseases. Just blind allegiance to Big Pharma and Big Brother. I encourage anyone to do the due diligence on becoming informed about the risks associated with vaccinations, and while you’re at it, look up the ingredients of these vaccines, while keeping in mind the FDA and the CDC budget cuts and how that could affect their oversight of these monied giant pharmaceutical conglomerates and their huge propaganda machine. All that being said, I am not completely opposed to vaccination, but I would like to see better oversight of the companies who make them, and more attention being given to other ways to stay healthy.
  • commented 2015-02-15 13:55:43 -0500
    Nick from Cincinatti nailed it. If you can afford it you should give up meat (all the way from seafood to beef) and dairy.

    Only issue I had with Nicj is his aversion to GMO. Anti-GMO crowd also fall for the naturalistic purity fallacy that the anti-vaxers fall for. Hope my fellow vegans/vegetarians give up their aversion to GMOs.